Amy Eliza Wong | Overcoming False Beliefs, Eating Disorders, & Living a Miracle Everyday

“It’s the secrecy that feeds the monster.” – Amy Eliza Wong

GUEST BIO:

Amy Eliza Wong is the founder of Always On Purpose®. She is a leadership coach, author, speaker, and facilitator working with organizations such as Salesforce, Roku, & LinkedIn. Amy offers leadership development and communication coaching to individuals, executives and corporate teams around the world, as well as institutions including Stanford University and the University of California at Berkeley. She pulls from various disciplines and practices to find a consilient approach to achieve flow and create profound impact through the three lenses of Self, Relationships, and Results. As a Conversational Intelligence® certified executive coach with expertise in transpersonal psychology, design thinking, public speaking, and interpersonal neurobiology, Amy has catalyzed transformative growth for hundreds of executives and teams. She has a passion for helping people identify blind spots and reclaim precious time & creative bandwidth. Her bestselling book, Living On Purpose, was released last year.

SHOW NOTES:

• Website: https://www.alwaysonpurpose.com
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amyelizawong/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/amyelizawong/

CORE THEMES, KEYWORDS, & MENTIONS:

• leadership coach, author, speaker, communication, false beliefs, limited beliefs, rejection, insecure, I don’t fit in, secure, I’m not good enough, timid, speaking up, breaking timidity, feeling empowered, inner shame, OCD, feeling out of control, sense of belonging, eating disorder, driven, anorexia, blackout, healing, food addict, controlling, binge eating, self control, binging purging cycle, control, self compassion, patience, powers of reflection, curiosity, survival mechanisms, finding order, beliefs, faith, self compassion, love, joy, having a child, logic, mathematics major, identity paralysis, postpartum depression, real surrender, absolute surrender, feelings, following our inspiration, following inspiration, synchronicity, flow

For more Remarkable Episodes, Inspiration, and Motivation, please visit https://davidpasqualone.com/remarkable-people-podcast/. Enjoy!

Transcript

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Amy Eliza Wong | Overcoming False Beliefs, Eating Disorders, & Living a Miracle Everyday 

Raised in a nightclub. The secrecy that feeds the monster, unlocking our feelings and living a miracle life every day. All this and more. Right now, 

INTERVIEW RPP S8 E811 Amy Eliza Wong 28 Aug 23-1: Hey Amy, how are you today? I'm fantastic. How about you? I am Remarkable, but I am having some struggles like we talked about earlier. So ladies and gentlemen, welcome to this Remarkable episode. Today we have Amy Wong, author of Living on Purpose. [00:01:00] Her story is fantastic, and she's about to share this with you.

She is a leadership coach, an author, and so much more. And at this time, Amy, we're going to jump into your story, go chronologically through your life to see the highs, the lows, the everything in between that made you the woman you are today. And inspired to write Living on Purpose. But before we get there, we have listeners all over the world, different cultures, different demographics.

When they stick through this episode, they're going to get tons of golden nuggets. But if you promise them one thing that they can take away and apply to their life, what will that be? Mm-hmm. More relief, more peace of mind, and a sense of possibility that joy and meaning is absolutely possible. Amen. Which of us doesn't need that, right?

Yeah. So let's go to the origins. Where is Amy from? What was your upbringing like? And we joke around, people listen to our podcast mainly, [00:02:00] but we do have a large viewership online, YouTube and Rumble. And when I saw your name, you and I joked about this months ago when we first met Amy Wong. Yeah. And then when I met you, Totally not for the last name.

So we'll get into that in the episode. It's the Seinfeld episode, right? Yeah. Watched. Do you remember that Seinfeld episode just watched? Yes. And then I watched this movie that, right, like the day before you and I spoke and the guy said, I changed my last name to Wong 'cause it's the most popular in the world and I'm hiding from people.

So I was just cracking up. But let's talk about the real Amy Eliza Wong. That's right. What was your upbringing like and just background. Absolutely. Well, the alluding so yes, my last name is now Wong. However, I'm, I'm blonde. I don't look like a traditional won Wong. And that usually makes people like, whoa.

Which, which is great. But I was born Amy, Amy Elisa [00:03:00] Martinez. And so the funny thing is, David, because I'm Mexican and I don't. I don't look Mexican. And so growing up, people even said, wait, what? And so now of course, being Amy Martinez Wong, I really confuse people, which is great. But that's so I was born Amy w Amy Martinez.

And you know, I have to say, I, I had a really charmed childhood in that my parents, they they're still, they're still married. They're having their 50th wedding anniversary this November, actually, which is really an incredible feat. They're best friends, they're awesome people. They're my favorite people.

And you know, I know a lot of humans don't have the privilege to be able to say that about their parents. So I feel very, very blessed now. My folks are quite evolved. They're lovely. They're fun, they're wise. And when I was really young, my dad's a musician as a hobby. [00:04:00] He's in the financial industry now, but I.

Growing up, he, he's a drummer. And so my parents bought a bar in Sacramento, in Northern California in the early twenties, and it turned out to be the hottest rock and roll bar in all of Northern California. And it's, and so the, so the, the, the fun fact about me was that I was raised in a nightclub. So that's where my early years started.

And that, I have to say, I, I think for that reason, I always had such a, so it was so, it's always been so easy for me to talk to adults or people older than me. 'cause most of my very young years were spent sitting up at the bar talking to the old geezers or talking to the regulars. And here I'm like three years old and just loving life.

It was great. And then interestingly, and, and I write about this in my book. It was a big [00:05:00] catalyst for me to help un to understand how we fundamentally hold ourselves back as humans. And I saw it for myself at an early age, but it was around three years old. My mom, she, you know, she felt horrible. She's like, what?

I've got this child in a bar. She needs to be around children, her own age. She shouldn't be around like, I need to be a better mother. I gotta, I gotta put her around kids her age. Now, from my point of view, I was loving life. I loved being with my parents. I loved being with my mom. I loved spending my afternoons on the stage.

You know, singing and just having a blast at life was fantastic. And I have a vivid memory of this. I was three years old. I, I was around three and I remember my mom scooped me up. I was, I think I was playing with Tinker Toys near kind of the front door and scooped me up and we left. Yeah, we're going somewhere [00:06:00] cool.

But we ended up driving to this building that was really colorful on the outside and you know, I'm really curious, like, yeah, okay, cool. We walk in and oh my gosh, David, I've never felt so overwhelmed in my life. The sights, the stimulation, and more importantly and more scarily the kids. There were so many little people I had never seen in one place in my life, and I was so terrified and I was so sc I was, I was really quite scared and I, and all, now of course, now my mom is wanting to pass me over to the daycare person because this is what you do.

And I just remember being so terrified, not knowing what was happening. My mom, of course, picking up on my mom's sense of sadness and anxiety about the whole thing. And I just remember so deeply feeling, oh my gosh, my mom doesn't want me around anymore. And at that point in my life, I firmly believe that's when I took on the belief that I wasn't good enough, [00:07:00] that I was a burden.

And that was the start of a false limiting belief that really kind of set the stage for the next couple of decades of my life. You know, and I share this because all of us humans have experiences like this, most benign, and some unfortunately are not benign. But we have these experiences of rejection that to our very young, underdeveloped brains, we don't, we can't really make sense of.

And so in order to make sense of the discomfort and the pain, we solidify a belief about ourselves to, to, to help us cope with this. And so that was mine. And it really, it, it, it, that belief stayed with me for, for quite some time. And moving beyond that is really the work of my work. Personal work, professional work.

And it's ultimately the reason I wrote the book. But that kinda sets the stage for my childhood. [00:08:00] And so my childhood, I was a very timid, very, very, very very good little girl. I was so afraid of getting in trouble. I didn't wanna rock the boat. I wanted to make sure everybody was okay and happy. And I just remember my, most of my early childhood years feeling so insecure, just feeling like I didn't, like I didn't fit in, or I wasn't quite part of the cool group or it, it's, I just didn't feel secure in my own skin.

And my mom thinks, That, you know, I was, I was on the young side for my grade. Now my birthday's in October. So, you know, for those folks that you're not kind of here and you're neither there, you either going to school really early or you'll wait a year and then you go the next year. Well, my mom put me in early because I could read words and I could die.

All of these things that were signs pointing to this child's brilliant, well, developmentally, [00:09:00] like socially, I wasn't quite there. And so I just always felt behind the curve, which when you have a belief that you're not good enough and then you've got it, just all of a sudden it just starts to compound.

And so very, just very timid growing up in my young years and couldn't, couldn't speak up, wouldn't even ask our server for a napkin, you know, God forbid I get, you know, pick up the phone and make dinner reservations for the family. I just, I was so timid and it wasn't until. Junior high that I had a my seventh grade teacher really saw something in me.

And thank goodness for the teachers in our life that really see something and pull it out, because that was a turning point for me. Ms. Johnson, she, she saw a spark in my eye and she really encouraged that. I run for student council now, seventh grade, I mean, do you remember going back to seventh grade?

David? [00:10:00] Do you remember those feelings of middle school? It's like, oh, the, remember? I mean, it's just so uncomfortable. Yeah. Oh, I uncomfortable. I don't wanna, I hate, first off, I hated school like I detached and by seventh grade, I don't know how your school was, but you had like, K through five. Then sixth and seventh was its own school, and then eighth was its own school, and then high school was its own school.

So in seventh grade, it's like you're trying to figure out who you are and you're not fitting in, and it's like, I'm about to go up to another school and I don't like the people during my class. And yeah, there's so much going on as you're trying to develop as a youth. Oh, it, it's, I feel like it's mother nature's worst joke, right?

Because here you are, you've got all these hormones running and it's, and you've have all these feelings and all these things and, and I swear to goodness, and she's like, all right, and this is going to be the worst you look in your life, right? With pimps in this. It's just one of [00:11:00] those interesting periods in our life where we just, oh gosh, it's so uncomfortable.

Kids are mean, and you're trying to find your crew and ugh, just so much. And so in. In seventh grade, somehow Ms. Johnson pierced through all of that anxiety and really encouraged me to run for student council. And oh my gosh, to get up in front of that entire student body and give my speech, that, that was probably one of the scariest things I've ever done in my life.

And it was pivotal because I, I proved to myself I could do it. I ended up in student council and it really set me on this path that that, that things were possible, that I could, I could feel, I could feel empowered. And so that was the beginning of, of a whole new trajectory. And it was during junior high that I started to realize that, you know, I'm [00:12:00] really good at.

Teaching and I'm really good at leading and I'm really good at translating. So I ended up being a, a junior counselor. I think there were only 12 of us chosen amongst the entire junior high where we were trained and we could, you know, we could pull kids outta class that needed extra support. And so that was a part of my history and, and I started tutoring little kids and it was, it just, things started to really get going and then I went off to high school.

High school. Hey, before you go on, can I ask you a couple questions? Yes, you may. Please. Were there any other children or were you the only child at that point, like in your growing up? Thank you. A good question. Yeah, good question. So, ah, yeah, this is, this is interesting. So now I'm the oldest. I have a sister who's five and a half years younger than me, and then a brother who is five and a half years younger than her.

So I'm 11 years from my brother. So we're, we're kind of s we're s. Were spread out. And so even the, the insecurities you were feeling, you had a brother or sister, you had sister and [00:13:00] brother, but it wasn't on the same level of communication and age at that time where they wouldn't understand. That's so you were kind of That's right.

On your own and adapting to these emotions and feelings. That's exactly right. That's exactly right. And I really kind of kept it to myself because, I mean, there was kind of some shame there. 'cause there's this feeling of like, you know, even though I couldn't quite put my finger on it, but it's like, God, I shouldn't have these feelings or something's wrong with me.

And, and so when you're at that age, the last thing you wanna do is admit that something's wrong with you. And so I pretty much kept it to myself. But interestingly too though, you know, my mom had a daycare and so at this point my, my parents had made a pivot where they had, that's quite the pivot from a bar to a daycare.

Well, so here's an even bigger pivot. So pivot. So my, my parents ended up selling the bar and I. Now my dad, so he's been at Morgan Stanley for, it's been over 35 something years. He went from that world to being a private wealth [00:14:00] advisor and he's, I mean, he's just, he's amazing to me. But he made a massive pivot when I was, you know, in grade school.

And so in order to kind of make it all work, my mom started a daycare. And so we had so many little kids in our house. And so I'm, you know, I'm, I'm here, I'm like 10, 11, 12, and then we had all these tiny little like 10, two year old, three year olds running through the house. And so it was constant chaos in our household.

And I would say loving chaos 'cause there's just a lot of love. But man was there a lot of chaos. And so I think. Because of that, that's also where I started to develop a lot of O c D tendencies. 'cause there's so much craziness around the house and then like around that, oh, I need to be in control, I need to be organized.

I need to start to be on, like, on top of things. And so it was going into junior high, I started to get pretty regimented and really pretty [00:15:00] organized. So by the time I went into high school I, I had a mindset that I was really driven. And by the way, it's interesting 'cause I, so I'm not Catholic and my dad, he was, he was baptized, born Catholic.

He's not practicing but. From junior high to high school, I really wanted to go to the private all girls Catholic high school. 'cause I knew that it was a better education than the public school I was zoned for. And so my dad was all for it. 'cause he is like private, like all girls high school. Of course I want you there, you know?

And then my mom's a dad's dream, right? Dad's dream. You're one of the anomalies that wants education over social, so congratulations. Right? So thank you. And my dad was all for it, but my mom was like, oh, what are you doing? No. And, and there, at first she was really concerned because, oh, now she's going to have to keep working and order to make this work.

And but because I wanted [00:16:00] it so badly, she was like, yeah, no, let's, that's fine. Let's do it. And so I, I, I did, I ended up going to this all girls private, Catholic high school. And man, it was probably one of the best experiences of my life because I learned so much in, in those four years and. I just, I so appreciate the quality of education, but this is when, this is when all hell broke loose.

I'm like, the wheels are turning so fast. I'm practicing piano every day. I'm really picking up on my studies. And then all of a sudden, like a, a switch inside of me flipped. And it had to do with just feeling outta control. And one of the things I was really starting to pick up on was like, how, like who's popular?

Who's not popular? Who's on the end crowd? Who's not on the end crowd? You know? And that sense of belonging, that need to belong is so strong in us. You know, in fact, David rejection as an [00:17:00] experience, registers as death to the brain. You know, and this is something we're not talking about as humans, and that's another reason why I wrote this book.

But back then, right, as a high schooler, I. I'm freshman, sophomore year, I'm desperately wanting to fit in and I'm doing everything I can to stay, you know, stay organized so that I can feel like I've got meaning and agency in my life. And when I was looking around, I was starting to, I, I made this I assessment that, ah, you know, who's popular, you know, who feels like the girls that really haven't made the ones that just feel like life is so easy.

They're really skinny and I'm not that skinny, but they're really skinny. Now for me, I was a gymnast and I, I was, I was in dance. I was, I'm very athletic and, and so I'm athletic. I've got a, got muscles on my legs. I'm, I'm, I'm not skinny. And, you know, and back then, this was the day of Kate Moss. Do you remember Kate Moss, the Wavelike Super Bowl?

Yeah. And yeah, [00:18:00] she was around in the nineties. Kate Moss, she did Sports Illustrated. I. And super skinny. Yeah. So those were our role models back then. Just really skinny. And so it clicked in my head, you know, what, if I'm going to, if I'm going to have it made too, I have to be super skinny. And that decision was the start of a debilitating eating disorder.

And that began, I mean, a journey that I truly wish on no one. And it's a journey I now look at as one of the most integral parts of my life that truly have led me to who I am today. And so, you know, for the next, so from sophomore, it was, it was, it was in between sophomore and junior year that, that I, I really succumbed to this.

And, and it's, it's very, it, it, it became very dark. It was again, I don't wish this on anyone that, that [00:19:00] Incredible preoccupation that just takes over. And I struggled with it all through college. So I ended up going to uc, Berkeley studied math. So that was something that started to, started to really pick up for me in high school.

It was this incredible passion for math. And I'm also a musician, so I play piano. That's something I started at age five 'cause my dad's a musician. I'm a so big part of my life was music. And a big part of my high school was math. And so all I wanted to do was math. And all I wanted to do was piano.

And so in high school I started teaching piano and I had a tutoring business and it was super driven. Super driven. But then I had this eating disorder running in the background that just it just ate away all of my life force. But somehow we managed to be quote unquote successful. Got it. To got into uc, Berkeley, I ended up majoring.

Mathematics at uc, Berkeley. And before you go on, I don't wanna keep interrupting you, but I wanna make sure No, please interrupt me. Jump in. Yeah, [00:20:00] please. Well, when people have eating disorders, sometimes it's ultra obvious and sometimes it's a complete secret and nobody knows. Yeah. So was yours a complete secret or was it people were trying to talk to you at that time?

I did everything I could to keep it totally private. My parents were the only ones that knew, and they were terrified for my safety, because here I am, I'm, you know, we, I'm from Sacramento and I'm going to a college that's about an hour and 45 minutes away. So not that far, but far enough for any loving, concerned parent to not be close enough to your child.

Because, you know, my eating disorder was so bad that I would black out a lot of times and I had fallen, you know, I, if I'm standing there and I'd black out and I remember, I. This was before I left for college, but I fell so hard that the head, my, the corner of my, of my really big sharp desk right into my forehead and, you know, so they were just, they [00:21:00] were so concerned and so they did everything they possibly could to try to support me and get me, he, you know, heal me from a distance.

But the truth is, David, my, my heart and my soul, they, it just wasn't ready for healing. And I didn't heal during those years. Not for their lack of trying. I just, it just, I wasn't ready at that point in time. And and lemme ask you another question if you don't mind. Yeah. Please. Because eating disorder, again, we have listeners all around the world and so you, this is in the nineties, correct?

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. So how. Health and fitness then and today, completely a different mentality. Oh my gosh. And when you say eating disorder, you don't like anorexia, bulimia. Were you starving yourself? Yes. What were you doing to control your weight? I, so what happened is it started as anorexia. So here's how it got started.

My mom had this book called take It Off, [00:22:00] keep It Off by this doctor named Dr. Art Eileen. And it was right when I made this realization like, oh, I think I need to be skinny. So I read the book literally in a weekend and I was hooked. And he presented this idea that if you chew your food, Really thoroughly.

And take 30, 30, like you chew 30 times before you swallow, you're going to enjoy your food more, you're going to digest better, you'll absorb your nutrients better. And oh, by the way, it takes about 20 minutes to feel satiation. So you're going to eat a lot less in that period. So I started doing that and because here I'm in this developmental stage as an adolescent, my body changed so quickly and I got so skinny that I got addicted to that.

It was like, whoa, look at this. So that, so that mindful exercise quickly turned into anorexia where I started controlling, controlling, controlling. And I started, you know, constricting, constricting, constricting. So I was [00:23:00] barely eating. And so for the first, so through those years of high school, up until about senior year, I was anorexic.

Very, very skinny, and I'm working out all the time. So I would, I would go to the gym and I'd be there when it opened at five in the morning, and I would work out for an hour and a half like max capacity. So just really driven, but then my body, it couldn't take it anymore. And so what would happen starting at night?

So I'd, I'd fall, I would crash because, you know, I'm, I'm driven, so I'm waking up at five, I'm working out for, you know, almost 90 minutes. Race, home, shower, race to school, to get to math lab before school even opens. So I can do more math problems that are really hard with my teacher. And then I study, study, study, study, study, study, study all day, race, home practice, piano for four hours.

And then I study for the rest of the night and I'm, I crash by 10 30. Now I'm exhausted. But what [00:24:00] started to happen was around one in the morning, my body would wake me up. Starving and it around one, I'm in that rummy, half asleep, half awake state. And what would end up happening is I would find myself in the kitchen binging, binging on cereal.

Binging on what? Because you know, we have a household of little kids and you know, and, and I've got younger siblings, so there's all these foods that are easy to binge. And it was, I was at that state where I didn't have self-control in the way that I do in my normal waking consciousness. And so what would, so what started to happen was that I got addicted to the binging and purging at night.

I was craving it and I was fearing it. It was the weirdest relationship where pretty quickly I started to fear going to bed because I was so afraid of the werewolf that was going to come. And I'll tell you, David, there was not one night that I was not visited by this, this, this force that woke me up to [00:25:00] binge and purge and that.

That cycle of anorexia by day and bulimia by night. That persisted all through to my senior year in college. And you know, it's wild. I, you know, so it'd hit around one in the morning and it would go till about three 30 or 3, 2, 3 30 or it just kind of depends. A couple hours. And then I would crash and then I'd be up at five and then I'd get to the gym and I would work out and here in at Cal, like, oh my gosh.

I'll tell you something. That was a lot of work. Oh, that was so much work. And there was a year I was an Air Force, R O T C 'cause I thought I wanted to be an aeronautical engineer. But I've got that and I'm tutoring and I'm working on this and I'm, I don't know how I did so well. I honestly do not know how I managed to get the G P A that I did to do as well as I did and not kill myself.

I genuinely don't know that. And it wasn't until senior year, [00:26:00] so now. To your point about being secret, I kept this so secret. The only people that knew were my parents. My best friend who I spent every, almost every moment of my waking day with her, 'cause she was a math major too. We studied together, we did everything together.

I, I kept it from her. I was, I'm very, very, very quiet. I was very discreet. She never, I never allowed her to spend the night because I was always, I'm a private person. Never had people visit and spend the night, 'cause I'm a private person. It was, it was a lot. But here's the thing. She knew and she never said anything because she knew that if she confronted me, I would shut her out.

She just knew in her heart that for those years, she just couldn't say anything until it was one day. It was my senior year and it was the, it's the last semester of senior year and. David, I've, I was so [00:27:00] depleted. I was so worn out. I was gaunt. I'm lifeless, I'm exhausted and I'm still powering through. And my, my best friend and I, we were leaving our math one 13 lecture.

It was abstract al no it was not abstract abstracty geometry. That's what it was. Fantastic class. We're leaving the class and it's early evening and we, we get to the corner of the campus and this is the point where we part, and so she goes to her apartment down the street, on campus apartment. And I am going to my car to go to my off-campus apartment 'cause I've got my own apartment.

In, you know, a different like in like outskirts of like the Oakland area. And I live by myself because Yeah, I was actually thinking that like, because if you had roommates in a normal college campus, I mean clearly they'd know. But did you have your own place then? I did, I did. But here's the thing, 'cause I did have a roommate in co freshman year and I did have a roommate, you know, and then I did [00:28:00] have an apartment where I had roommates, but I was very discreet at night.

And even the, my boyfriends at the time where I would, you know, be with them overnight or what, I was still so discreet. There was never, I mean, and if they knew, they never let me know that they knew they could very well have known. But there was no talking about it. No talking about it. So this one day we are at the corner and we're about to part, and she looks at me and she goes, Amy, come over, come over for dinner.

And I'm like, Now, here's the thing, we had an unspoken rule. I never went to her apartment 'cause she had roommates and she and I had an, I had an apartment and I always cooked. And, 'cause that's the thing with an eating disorder, you know you're going to be in control of everything. So I always cooked and lavish and so that I can shower people with food, but then I don't have to eat it.

And that was always our thing. And, and it worked great. And so when she says, come over to my place, I'll cook us dinner. It was like, Nope. That that breaks, that breaks the [00:29:00] rule. And so I, I fought, she goes, no, I'm not going to take no for an answer. I'm not going to take no for an answer. And I don't know what it was, but something in me just buckled.

And I said, okay, I'll come over. And she's like, bring your, yeah, you have a new laptop. Because back in the day, like laptops were just kind of get starting to get big. She's like, why don't you go get your laptop? Come, you could show me. And I'm like, okay, I'll go back to my house and I'll, okay. So anyway, went to her place and.

She makes veggie spaghetti. And we had just, we're just at the point where we had just turned 21, so she had a bottle of wine and poured us a glass of wine. And we're sitting there, and you have to remember, she's my best friend in the world. So we have this just the most delightful and amazing friendship.

She says to me, Amy, I have a secret and I'm really ashamed and I really, I, I'm really embarrassed and this is really hard for me to share with [00:30:00] you. And I'm like what? And she goes, Amy, I, I don't know what to do about this, but I'm really scared. I when you go off to your second work workout during the day when I go to Moses, the Moses building, 'cause she's a philosophy minor to go to my philosophy classes.

I smoke on the balcony and, and when we part in the a evenings and I go to my apartment, like I smart smoke on my balcony and you know, like, I thought I was just doing it casually, and I thought I could just stop. She goes, but I tried, I've tried to stop for the past two weeks and I can't stop, and I'm really scared.

I'm addicted to smoking. And I was like, what? Like, like what? And she starts crying and I start crying and I hold her and I'm like, oh my gosh. When it's, it's okay. Gosh, thank you so much for sharing this. She's like, I just feel so bad. I'm so ashamed. I've had the secret. And I just started bawling. And I said, [00:31:00] I so feel you.

And I said, I said, my friend, I've got, I've got a secret for you too. I have something I'm really ashamed about. And I, I op, I, I proceeded to open up and I shared everything and I'm, I'm sobbing, and she's crying. And at the end of all of it, she looks at me and she goes, honey, I, I know. I know and it's going to be okay.

And she just held me. And I'll tell you, the human heart, David, there's something so healing about being seen and releasing those, just that tight grip of shame in this presence of unconditional love. And there was a release for both of us. And here's what happened. You ready for this? I went home that night and it was [00:32:00] the first time I slept all night without being woken up by the werewolf.

And when I woke up that next morning, I knew that I was on the path to healing. And boy, you can. But I was so excited meeting her in our math lecture the next morning. I'm like, guess what? I slept all night. And she was so happy for me, and I was so happy. And truly it was, it was, and, and fortunate. And for her, that's when she stopped smoking and she was on it.

She's like, I, she goes, I don't have a need. I don't feel a need to smoke anymore. So she stopped smoking. And for me, that put me on the path of healing. And so it took, it took a couple years of a lot of self-compassion, a lot of patience to, to evolve from the behaviors that were deeply ingrained in me over those past, you know, over that past five years or whatever it was, six years maybe.

[00:33:00] And and then I would say it probably took another five to six years to evolve from the mindset that an eating disorder is. But it looking back at it, it truly was hell. And, you know, I did a, a period of my life. So fast forward just for a moment, I became a coach. I started coaching in 2010, and there was a period in my coaching where I was working at a drug and rehab center as a group coach.

And I would come and I would work with all of their clients. They were called, you know, they, because it was volunteer and inpatient. And I would come and, and we'd have two hours, I'd have two hours with 30, 30 clients of theirs. And we would just make magic. And rarely, but sometimes they would say, Ugh, what do you know, you know, nothing about our struggles.

And I'd say, you know, I've got something to share with you that I wasn't, I, I hear what you're saying and I can imagine that it doesn't feel like [00:34:00] I understand. And you're right in that I've never been a addicted to a substance, but I do know what addiction is, and I do know what this hell is. And I would share about my eating disorder.

And I said, so I know. No, I know. I know the hell that you're in. I know how the depths of this pain. I said, you know, whether it's a substance or whether it's food, it's, it is, it's a very, very, very, very painful place. And I look back at that and I'll tell you, if it was not for this dark period in my life, which I call manure, right?

It's not crap, it's manure, it's fertilizer. I would not have these incredible blossoms that I have today. The powers of reflection, the powers of understanding humanity, and our strength and our resiliency, the curiosity that I innately have about the human condition and what it truly means to thrive. I would not be able to do this work and serve humanity in the way that I do if I hadn't gone [00:35:00] through that.

And so what this has helped me do at this point in my state, in my life, is really for, for me to. Not just for myself, but for others to see that the crap that happens to us, yeah, we could look at it as crap, but we can also choose to see it as manure because our growth doesn't happen only in the light.

It also happens in the dark. And our work is to embrace both. Because if we can embrace that growing, I call it growing on accident, when stuff happens that we didn't intend, that hurts, that feels like failure, that feels like disappointment. If we can embrace that as a part of the path, just as much as we embrace the light, the stuff that we do on purpose, such as the degree or the program or the this, if we can take both and say both are purposeful, oh, what becomes possible is just magnificent.

And so, [00:36:00] yeah. So that's kinda, that's kinda what put me at this point. Mm-hmm. And that's amazing, Amy, because you know, the two things I'm thinking 50 things, but for all our listeners around the world, again, culture's different. But if you're addicted to food, if you're addicted to sex, if you're addicted to drugs, if you're addicted to alcohol as a drug, but it, it doesn't matter what addiction is, it's stemming from a deep need inside.

Yeah. And what I hope, when people hear your story in a second, when you and your friend brought it into the light, you know, the Bible talks about all, all over the Bible, but one John specifically talks about bringing the truth into the light. And when people hide in darkness, evil grows, bad grows, pain grows.

But when you bring what people we're all lied to by [00:37:00] society, by Satan, and we're like, I can't share this, I'm ashamed. The truth is, in that moment, your friend got off smoking and that was the catalyst for you to get healed from the food addic, not the food addiction, but from the eating disorders. So it's, I hope if, for all of our listeners, and for me and Amy, we remember that if we're just honest with ourselves and God and others, that's where the healing starts.

I mean, and I don't wanna say something you don't agree with, but would you agree with that? Oh, I a hundred percent agree. Is that when you, when you shed loving awareness on all parts of yourself, that's when healing begins. It's that acceptance of just, it's just love. It's meeting it with love, and that's what heals.

Yeah. And before we move forward at this point in life forward. Yeah. I, I wanna ask you another question about control that came up several times. For most people with addiction, they [00:38:00] feel outta control. So it's a way to take control, even if it's self damning. But for you, you mentioned that specifically in your story, was that lack of control and that ins insecurity in you something that there was another cause in your childhood that we maybe didn't talk about it?

Or was it just, that's just how you were? I, you know, it's a great question and I can, I, I've reflected on this quite a bit and I, I just, I, I wonder if it's a unique mix of having a deep, you know, back then having a deep seated fear and belief that I wasn't good enough, and being in an environment that felt so overstimulating and so out of control, even though it was in control.

I mean, nothing, nothing was burning, nothing was, you know, yeah, there was no one at risk or nothing at risk, but just to a little being that maybe is sensitive, like it felt so overstimulating [00:39:00] to try to make sense of that. Without upsetting the apple cart. Right. Because what is my prime directive is to ensure that my mom and dad are happy that they, that they know that they don't have to worry about me.

'cause these are my survival mechanisms. In order to ensure that I'm accepted in love is to make sure that they are okay and like, okay, I don't wanna stress them out. I don't wanna tell them about my okay. And it's just gotta keep all, gotta keep all this, this engine running. I gotta keep all this going.

And I think it was this deep, deep, deep need to find order and have a sense of order and control because everything felt so out of control that just fed, it was like, it was like a, just like a spark to dry, to dry brush, like started a whole wildfire. I think it was just, and it was my unique path. But interestingly though, I do think there's an ancestral component to it because my mom had an eating disorder, my [00:40:00] grandma had an eating disorder.

Turns out my uncle, my mom's brother had an eating disorder. And so, you know, so there's kind of this, you know, in the family lineage, maybe something about, you know, beliefs about image, beliefs about control. I don't know, but I think I carried that through as well. Yeah. And to our listeners, like, okay, I get it.

I'm struggling with this now, or my kid's struggling with this. Obviously everybody's situation's different, but what are some steps to take, to start the journey of healing? Obviously number one is bring it to the light. Get people who love you on board, but what else did you do that we're catalyst? And again, if we're going to move forward in your story, so if that's going to come out, just keep talking.

But if not, that's, it's a kind of a break. No, this is a, I think this is a perfect time to mention it. I think I, so I truly, I personally, I so appreciate the [00:41:00] power of belief and I, and I don't think we give it enough credit. And even though I had a belief that I wasn't good enough, I also equally had a belief that I was strong and that my mind could overcome anything.

And I also had a belief, and I didn't give it much airtime, but underneath all of this was I had a belief that I wouldn't have this forever. I believed, I firmly believed that there would be a period in time that I would be healed from this. But the path between here and healed was really elusive. I know, like from where I was standing in the midst of it, it wasn't obvious.

However, I had faith that I would, I would overcome this, and there would be a day when I'd be able to look back and say, yeah, that was sucked, but I don't have it anymore. And I see meaning and purpose. So I think, you know, if I could be intentional going back, back to that time really [00:42:00] appreciating and putting a bit more focus and a bit more light on just that belief that I do have a belief that this will, that, that I, I, and I know I have faith that I will get through this and I don't have to know how, but I'm just going to rely on the faith that it will.

And so that was very strong in me, even though it wasn't totally obvious to the conscious mind that it was there. And I would say that plus, as you say, self-compassion, love, and bringing it into the light with those that you love, because it's the secrecy that feeds, you know, the monster of it, that energy.

And the more we can bring it out into the light without judgment, without shame. It takes its power away. And you know, that's just a decision we have to make at some point to say, is it more important to hold the [00:43:00] secret or is it more important to start healing? Because when you're met with an opportunity to maybe expose yourself, oh man, it's scary as hell.

Oh my gosh. And unless you have that desire to heal and that's stronger than the need to hide you'll continue to choose to keep it secret. But as long as you continue to choose to keep it secret, you can't really be on that path of healing because it's all enshrouded in shame. And shame isn't part of the equation when it comes to healing.

So in your journey now, the secret's out mm-hmm. And you start growing and developing, where does your life go from there, Amy? So, so here's where it gets funny and ironic. So here I'm. I'm now I'll mention that I started interning. So in the midst of all of this, right? So not only am I like working hard at this degree, which is really freaking hard, [00:44:00] I started interning at Sun Microsystems when I was 18.

So back in the day, that was like the big tech giant. It was Sun Microsystems and Microsoft. Do you remember that back, back then? A lot of folks today, don't, you know, young folks, right? Don't remember. But so I, I got my career started in tech when I was 18, and I found a niche for myself so that even though I was interning over the summer is what ended up happening was that my niche was so important that I started working during my, so I was, I was working my junior and senior year during the school year.

And so not only am I finishing my degree, but I'm also still working at Sun Microsystem. So this whole thing about remote work, I've, I've been doing that since like early nineties. I don't know why I'm making such a big deal out of it. It's not, it's great. And so. By the time I graduate in 2001, I was really quite established, and so I went right into my career and it just started to take off.

And I loved what I did, and I loved, I loved everything about what I [00:45:00] was just, I, I was thriving at this point, and, and now that I'm alive, I'm free for the first time since kind of close to eight years old, right? I'm really feeling, I'm feeling free. I'm feeling unburdened, and because of this now I want to live because the first 10 years of, you know, prior I was completely restricted.

I was so, you know, joy was not something I ever gave myself permission to feel. And so now on this side of my life, Now I'm choosing it freely. And so what that meant for me was, again, my best friend and me, we went to all the fancy restaurants and I was, I would always treat us because I'm, I'm making bank now, right?

'cause I've got this amazing job and I'm my early twenties and I'm traveling the world and I have incredible team members and I've got just, I'm living the, I'm living the life. And so we went out and we would, we would eat and find foods and find [00:46:00] wine and just totally living it up. And so it was in 2004 that one of the biggest hottest restaurants in San Francisco.

It was, the name was Bahar. Back in the day, three stories had a hundred wines by the glass, 1100 wines by the bottle, live jazz on Fridays. I found that they had this incredible happy hour. And like dollar oysters and half off all these wines. And so I told my best friend, I'm like, okay, every Friday we're going to meet when, when the bar opens at three and we're just going to totally live it up.

And so she worked at U C S F at the time, and so we would meet and oh my gosh, we just lived like, just the life of luxury. And the funny thing is, David, every time I'd come in, the staff, they just treated me like royalty. They'd say, oh, our superstars here, our favorite person's here. And they were so good to me.

The [00:47:00] manager loved me of the restaurant and I thought it was because they all liked me. No, but apparently Mr. Big boss man, who is the owner and executive chef of the restaurant, ends up having this massive, massive crush on me. And you know, he'd be like from behind the kitchen, like every time I'd come in, he'd be like, oh, oh, she's here now.

If. If you knew this man, it's like he's super focused, super, super serious, super on it, like doesn't, doesn't show any of that. So you can only imagine that everybody would be super excited when I came in. So long story short, they got us to meet and this is now my husband. Nice. This man is he's truly a, he's, he is a master.

He is, he had two very, very big restaurants back in when we met. And so it's just ironic and it just makes everybody laugh. Like here I am having, he just kind of on the heels of, of healed from, from this eating disorder. I marry a, an executive chef [00:48:00] and restaurateur. And so like, man, he happens to own a huge wholesale bakery.

And anyway, it, so it's kind of one of those things like, yeah, I kind of, kind of have to heal here. That's awesome. And if you didn't start eating normally, you would never have met him, so it all worked out. Exactly. You know, and what bonded us and what I tell folks is that we have such a deep love of.

Connection and joy because you know, when you don't know what that feels like because you've squeezed yourself away from it, off from it, you know, enjoyment, pleasure, presence, connection, then you really have an opportunity to truly appreciate it. And so he brings that an exquisite level of presence and appreciation to the culinary arts and to entertaining and to just connection and people as I do too.

And I'm certain that's one of the reasons that we have such, we have such a soul bond with one another. Yeah. That's fantastic. So now [00:49:00] you guys meet, Your career's booming mm-hmm. Between there and today. Take us through your life, Amy. Yeah. So careers booming. His is too, and we are like the power couple and life is fantastic.

We get married pretty well. We meet, and this man, he's, he's like, he knew, he's like, this woman's my wife. Like within a couple months he proposed. I, I knew pretty early on. I'm like, this man is my husband. Like, we just, we are meant to be together. So we've been married 17 years now, so it's, we know for a fact.

Congratulations. Well, thank you. Yeah, we are, we are definitely partners through and through, but all is going like, all is well. And then we have a baby and so my son Aiden, my first child, he was born in 2008. Oh, what a dream come true. He is just such a blessing now. My career up to this point was everything.

To me, it was my life. It was my identity. I was rising the ranks quickly. I was successful. I was [00:50:00] finding all of my self fulfillment and self-worth from this thing called my career. And man, there's nothing like having a kid to just wacky upside the head and make you question everything you think, you know.

Oh my gosh. Talk about, I, I don't even know how to put it. Like it's, this is the best way I can put it. Okay. Up until you have a child that you are, that comes out of you, or it is of you, your entire world revolves around you and you don't even realize it. Until it doesn't anymore, and there's no way to appreciate that until it's doesn't do that anymore.

And so here you are, you get your life around you, and then now you get this child and that entire access shifts, and now it's around this child, which is not, it's fine. It's not a big deal. This is just what happens to people that have children. But what's crazy about this is that everything changes because what was so [00:51:00] natural is now not natural.

And so all of a sudden you're not living for yourself anymore. You're kind of living for this being. And what you lose is not freedom, let's say, of action, right? You don't lose like, oh, if, if we wanna, we wanna get away for a weekend, we bring grandma in. If we wanna go to Burning Man, we bring Grandma in for a week.

Like we can do things if we want. However, what you lose is freedom of thought because now. Your mortality and this desire to nourish and be with this being is so strong that it's just a totally different reality. And as a result, it causes you to question your priorities. And so now I'm having, I have this baby, I had every intention of going back to work, but now I couldn't at all.

And I didn't have a logical explanation as to [00:52:00] why. And this whacked me out. 'cause Dave, you have to remember, I'm a pure mathematics major. I am a master at logic. I am a master at being able to take a ton of disparate data, seemingly unrelated data, finding patterns and meaning, and essentially saying, here, here's what we're dealing with.

That's, that's what I do. And so now that I can't explain why I want, I can't go back, I had to come up with a, a framework for myself. And I was like, okay. All right. Okay. If, okay, I, all right. Yeah. I'm going to go back If I can say yes to one of these three things. So I had to create a framework. Okay. Like, do we need my income in order to go back?

Like, no, we don't need it. We'll, we'll be able to survive so we don't have to do it. Okay? So can't say yes for that reason. Do is this my life's purpose? To design UI interfaces for our configurator and train our partners worldwide? And no, that is not my life's purpose. I can say that for certainty. [00:53:00] Is this my only outlet for social interaction and, and just personal fulfillment?

No, that's not true. Okay, so I can't say yes to any of this, so why would I go back? But, but then to say, well, if I'm not going back, then who am I? That was the biggest hole. My self understanding and it caused the bottom to drop out. And I actually fell into what I think is a dark night of the soul because I was so lost.

And in cognitive science, it's called identity paralysis. I went through identity paralysis and at the same time I felt so guilty and so awful. 'cause I'm like, I have this incredible baby boy that I am madly in love with. I've got an amazing husband, I've got a lovely life. What the heck is wrong with me?

Why can't I get myself together? And so I was really struggling for a good couple of months. And in the decision to not go back, I had told my [00:54:00] boss and, and it was that day of coming back after telling her now by boss, we are still very, very close. She is one of those pivotal people in my life that just, hmm, God, I love her so much.

And of course it's to disappoint her that I'm not coming back. Oh my gosh. Like, oh, this is just too much. So here's where the shift happened, David. This is when everything changed. I come home, I am low and I greet Arnold, my husband at the door. He said, how did it go? And I'm like, you know what, Adrian understands, she's a mom herself.

It's going to be okay. And I was really struggling between, I should be really happy. I am happy, I am happy I get to be with my son, but I don't know who. But what it was just this feeling of lostness. So I walk up the stairs to go into my bedroom and I'm going to change from like my work clothes to my mommy uniform.

You know, all of us parents have that mommy uniform, right? It's the old sweatpants and like the sweatshirt with the spit up stains [00:55:00] on it, you know? And you just gotta get comfy. 'cause I'm going to, I'm a mom now, so I, and I'm in my closet and I become overwhelmed with this sense, this need. And here it is. I, what I did was, I don't know where this came from, but I threw my hands to the side and I looked up to my se to the ceiling and I said, I give up.

You show me the way, like I give up. And in that moment of what I consider to be real surrender, that really wasn't prompted by anything other than this. I think a part of my soul, David, I was hit with the most electric insight that reverberated through my body. And I, the only thing I can say, it was a divine download in the moment of this surrender, I totally, I, [00:56:00] I felt throughout this body, something shifted in me, and here's what I had.

Literally, I didn't hear it audibly, but what was injected into my knowing, I. As a result of this electrified, almost like lightning bolt was Amy, you're going about it all wrong. Life's not about figuring it out. It's about feeling it out. And all of a sudden it was like, oh,

I get it. And then what happened with that insight? It wasn't a conceptual knowing. It was a embodied wisdom that hit me. And here and here's, here's what shift, here's what happened in that download. I got that. All of us humans, everything. Everything that we are, everything that we do, everything that we want, we think we have goals to go get the things [00:57:00] to achieve the things for happiness, and we stop there.

But that's total baloney. We want what we want, and we do what we do because we want the feeling we think we would have as a result of the thing. At the end of every single desire, at the end of every single goal, it's, it's not a number, it's not a title, it's not a big house. It's the feeling we actually want, but we totally don't think about it that way.

And we get stuck on the thing. And so we figure out our way to the thing. Oftentimes forsaking the feeling, creating these lives that look decent on paper, but then we wonder why the heck we're so miserable or hollow or whatever it might be. And this became so clear to me that every everything changed in a moment.

And from that point forward, my entire life changed. And that moment, in that massive shift, I made a commitment to myself and it was this. Okay, got it. So if [00:58:00] everything we want is for a feeling, Not the thing, then I can't strategize my way to what's next. I have to feel into what feels expansive, right? And so in that moment, I committed to following my inspiration, that heart opening like this versus, oh, it sounds like a good idea.

Nope, I'm going to follow what feels open, relieving, expansive, which feels inspired versus sensible. And that was the start of an entirely new life. And so, very quickly, the moment I made that decision, my inspiration led me to my quantum physics books. And I picked those back up. And honestly, I'll, I mean, I'll pause here if you just because I've been talking so much, but I'll tell you No, no, no, I'm, I'm, I'm down.

This is great. It, I mean, it just took off like wildfire. And the person I am today and the life and the work that I do today is wildly [00:59:00] different. Than who I was leading up to it. But it was all predicated upon this massive download about what's really true for us, incredible humans here. Yeah. Hmm.

Beautiful. So where are you today? Like, what does Amy's life look like today? Yeah. Well, I'll tell you. So today I am so fortunate. I get to, I, I truly get to live a miracle every single day. I get to work with the most. I just, I get to work with incredible people that are having incredible impact in the world, and I essentially unleash them and unlock them from all the things that they are doing that are keeping them from having the impact that they genuinely desire to have that ultimately makes this world a better place.

And to the degree that I can, I mean, I just, I. I feel so blessed. And if it wasn't for this journey that I'd been [01:00:00] on with the, the experiences I've had, I wouldn't have had these insights and been on this path to be able to do this work. I will say, you know, when I decided and I committed to following my inspiration, it led me to go back and get my master's in transpersonal psychology.

Now here, what was funny, so shortly after the, the download, I'm, I'm reading my, my, I'm reading my physics books 'cause I'm fascinated by it. And I'm like, okay, yeah, I'm just going to follow my inspiration. It's telling me to read my physics books. And then, and then I had this insight to, I should look up the author.

I know nothing about this. I know nothing about this guy, theoretical physicist. I should look him up. And so outta nowhere I get hit with the inspiration. I should look him up. So I'm Aiden's napping and I'm, I'm okay. Let look him up. So I look him up. And it just so happens that, and this is the power of synchronicity.

When you truly listen to inspiration, everything feels magical. That night I was hit with that, thought I should look him up. Turns out this guy lives in Cambridge, Massachusetts. I live in San Francisco That night he was [01:01:00] speaking at the Unitarian Church down the street that night. And if I hadn't had the insight to look him up that afternoon while I was reading his book, I wouldn't have been able to go.

And so it was little things like these incredible experiences of synchronicity just kept leading me down this path. And I kept following it with faith even though it didn't make sense because when it, when these breadcrumbs led me to the field of transpersonal psychology, I was like, oh my gosh, I have to study.

I have to study this. And my dear husband was like, what are you going to do with that? And I'm like, I don't know. I dunno, but I gotta study it. And he goes, are you licensed or anything? And I'm like, Nope. Oh, well, I, that's the greatest part. Like, I don't, I just gotta go study it. And he goes, oh, oh, okay. And God, God bless that man.

Like, he's so loving. He's like, all right, well let's, let's figure this one out. And so I cashed in my part of my 4 [01:02:00] 0 1 K to make this happen because I'm like, this is important to me. And I did, and I'll tell you, David, that's, it was, it was in my graduate degree that all of a sudden I'm like, I get it. I get why my soul led me to math and also led me to this because the, it's the blending of these two very seemingly disparate fields that lends itself perfectly.

To the work I'm here to do in the world. And if it wasn't for the very rigorous left brain logic and the very rigorous right brain exercise and understanding truth and truth in two totally different ways, then I'm actually able to work with folks and translate whatever needs to be translated in order for them to wake up, to evolve, to transcend, and to be the best person, and to be the best leader, to be the most effective, impactful leader they possibly can be.

And so that's, that's kind of where this has led me. And so for the past decade plus, since 2010, I've been working [01:03:00] with hundreds and hundreds of folks and over those conversations because of my passion, because of what I study, because of all of the, the things I find so fascinating about this work. I am certified in conversational intelligence, interpersonal neurobiology, all aspects of neuroscience of communication.

Like I, I just, I follow my inspiration and over the course of these, of this decade when I'm having all these conversations and I'm immersed in these different fields, I started to see very fundamentally like the things that we do to hold ourselves back. And that's what this book is about. So this book offers a roadmap of five deliberate choices to realize genuine fulfillment and innate joy that is available to all of us.

We just keep ourselves from it. And it doesn't matter if you are a high school student. It doesn't matter if you are a recovering addict. It doesn't matter if you are a c e O of a Fortune 500. [01:04:00] It doesn't matter if you're a celebrity, it doesn't matter if it applies to everybody. And so, over the course of this decade, I've done a lot of research.

I've done a lot of experiments. This book is a collection of a lot of case studies, my own personal experience, a lot of the science behind why these five per five deliberate choices will truly free you to the life that you were born to live. That's amazing. And I think one point that we all know, but it needs to be said straight up, is that you didn't just hear God and the inspiration for your life, but you acted.

You didn't drag your feet, you didn't delay, you took action. Correct. Immediately I said, you know, I knew in my heart that this is such a privilege and such a gift that I must operationalize this, that that was my duty. And it wasn't like, it wasn't a conceptual thought, it was just an knowing. But fortunately I did have the insight [01:05:00] into how to translate this.

'cause it's one thing to hear, oh, it's not about figuring out, it's about feeling it out. But then to have the next thought of, okay, well what do I do about that? So however, I came to the idea that, okay, well then I guess that means that inspiration is language of the soul, and strategy is language of the mind, and inspiration is the path of least resistance to the most abundance while strategy figuring it out.

While that's interesting and lots of drama and fun drama, it's the long path to the stuff we think we want, which usually ends up us having us scratch our heads going like, my life is, my life is decent, but why am I miserable? Right? And so to, to really get how to action this, I would say, is a gift again too.

And I committed to it and it was [01:06:00] challenging, right? Because here I am, a very sensible person. I'm, my gosh, I studied mathematics. So of course everything needs to make sense to me, and so. Now I'm making choices that are totally illogical. It's like, well, that, that's weird. And so it's almost like stanza. Do you remember the episode where you do like absolutely everything you, your instincts tell you, right?

It's like, it's like, okay, I'm going to follow my instincts even though it doesn't make sense. And I'm going to have faith that it's going to work out because it has to, because this is coming from something bigger than myself. And so let's go for it. What do we got to lose? And I think it was that surrender and that positive anticipation of abundance, not meaning that it was going to be easy, right?

We can't expect that that growth and greatness is going to be a linear path of feeling good. Oh my goodness. No one ever said feeling good is in an indicator of progress, right? And so you kinda have to hold all of this. And that's what I did. And I [01:07:00] acted and man did it. Has it paid off? And it continues to.

Yeah. Yeah. And that absolute surrender, you know, all through the Bible it talks about the talks of the lip, the talk of the lips tend to only to penry, meaning talk talks cheap, you know? And it says, when we have the vision from God, we need to do it. We can't wait and delay. So one of the things that you've talked about a lot is feelings and whether someone calls it feelings or a leading or intuition or inspiration, there's different terms people use, but it's seemingly the same thing.

Mm-hmm. But a lot of people are so wired, like you are a mathematical brain or a logical brain, or I, I just don't feel stuff 'cause a damage done in my past. Yeah. What's your advice? Maybe some steps people can take Yeah. To unlocking the feelings to start feeling again. Oh, thank you so much for this most important question because we've, I would say a, a lot of let's do to our educational system too.

We really [01:08:00] train ourselves away from the wisdom of our. Bodies of our feelings. And there's so much information that is held in our, in our, in our feeling states. And so I would say kind of step-by-step process, the first decision you have to make if you wanna start playing with this, is very fundamentally, you just have to decide that you're going to care way more about how you feel, right?

And because you can't really start to heighten your awareness without the intention to do so. So it really starts with a fundamental decision. Okay, you know what? I'm actually going to care about how I feel. I'm going to care about my feelings since I'm going to actually, okay, I'm going to, yeah, I'm going to maybe decide that maybe there's stuff going on in my en body here that's going to tell me stuff.

So you just have to decide to care. And then the second thing I would say is that after you've made that decision to, to really care, then you're going to feel for two [01:09:00] things to start. So, There's two kinds of energy that we will be holding. Well, well, I guess there's three, but I'll, for the sake of distinction, I'll, I'll leave it.

Kind of these opposites, we're either going to feel constricted or we're going to feel expansive. Right? And that constricted feeling. And, and you know how all of this goes, like, ah, versus, ah, like, so let's, let me give you an example. Let's imagine it's, it's Friday night and your partner says to you, oh, hey, you know, we've got, we've got these plans.

We're supposed to go to our neighbor, and we're going to, you know, we, we've, we've gotta do, you know, I don't know. There, there's plans that are happening Friday night and yet, You were told that you had these other plans and like your colleague and inviting you over for cocktails and, and it's like, oh, and that sounded like a right idea 'cause your boss is going to be there and you're trying to get yourself positioned to take on this [01:10:00] new project.

And so it feels, or no, sorry, it's, it's just like, it sounds like such a good idea, but then these plans you had with your neighbor just that when you determine the two or when you, when you think about, and you assess the difference of the two, you've got these two, two plans here. Generally what will happen is one is going to make you feel like this and one's going to make you feel like this.

Now, if you feel like this and there's like a little bit of constriction, it still might be a really exciting idea. Like, oh, yep, I wanna, I wanna be there with my colleagues and my boss and I, but there's like kind of this tightness, there's this, and there's a lot of energy running up in the head versus kind of down lower here in the heart.

But then when you think about, okay, well actually wanna be with our neighbors and we haven't seen for a while. There's kind of this opening and there's a feeling of relief. And so those are the two things you're going to start to feel for is what feels expansive and what feels constrictive. Because feeling it out is [01:11:00] always going to be the path of relief versus this.

And sometimes it can be hard to honor that because you're figuring it out. Mind the one that tends to make you feel a little constricted. That's the one that wants to put in all the plans and to get it right and to make sure it all lines up. It makes sense, but often it's the one, the path that makes sense that the one is the long path to real fulfillment.

And so if you can just make the decision. To listen for and in your body what feels open. And if you can see me, if you're, if there's a video, you can just kinda see there's like, just like an expansion, like relief. It's almost in the chest or the gut or a little tightness where there's more energy up in the head.

And those are the only two things I want you to really, really listen for and tell the difference about. And then to take it a step [01:12:00] further, trust the expansive feeling and follow it, because that is really when all of a sudden things start to feel a little magical synchronicity starts to happen. All of a sudden, the right conversations, the right people, new insights.

'cause essentially what's happening is when you choose the expanded feeling, you're opening up for flow. I mean, think about it. 'cause if you're constricted, you're, you're squeezing off your own bandwidth. For ideas and insights and opportunities. So you have less opportunities and less possibilities flowing through to you.

And so I guess in short form, listen and feel for this, the, the more, more relief. And then go for that. And then as you continue to practice this, it gets easier and easier and easier. And as, and you'll become more sensitive to your feeling states. And would you agree too, that if someone has two choices and neither feel good, don't do either and [01:13:00] don't force one, right?

Yes. Oh my gosh, yes. And so this actually comes to point the second choice in my book. So you, you went right to what kind of the logical roadmap here. So the first choice is feel it out, don't figure it out. And the second one is, there is no way things should be, and you're speaking right to this, okay, well I should be going to this or I should be going to, that we hold ourselves hostage to this idea that there's a way things should be.

It's like, wait, there is no way this should be. There is no should about it. And to your point, when you follow your inspiration, you'll start to see clearly. Oh yeah. Well, neither of these feel good. And so I'm going to honor this is, there is no should about going here or going there, and that's okay. Yeah, man, this has been fantastic and I think we could go another three hours.

But between your birth and today, is there anything else that we missed, Amy, that you wanna talk about or we wanna transition into? [01:14:00] What's the best way for people to reach you to continue the conversation? Yeah. You know, thank you for that. I would say what I, I so deeply, deeply, deeply, deeply live and care for so much is that for every single human to know that they are whole and complete and that joy and meaning and that sense of.

Just life is innate within each and every one of us. And it is possible, and it becomes possible when you decide that, you know what my, I actually, I am, I can be on this path of joy. I can be on this path of meaning if I choose to really listen, follow the feeling instead of the strategy. And that's really when we start to heal humanity, is when people can tap into their innate joy and innate wisdom, knowing that they're whole incomplete on, you know, [01:15:00] being on this path.

And it's possible, it's possible for everybody. Amen. And if somebody wants to get ahold of you, what's the best way? We'll put links in the show notes, but what's your preferred way for people to reach out and talk and, and like connect with you? Yeah. Well, I would say, if this is interesting to you, my website.

Always on purpose.com. I have a ton of articles, a ton of free tools. I would love for you. Go check it out. There's so much information there. You can also stay in touch with me via my website. I have, you can sign up to be in touch with me over text. I sent inspirational messages, you know, every week. And so that's available on the website.

You can sign up for my newsletter and get inspiration and articles. I'm also on not, so I'm starting to get more so on Instagram. I just, I've been so busy with clients, it's hard to be on social media, but I'm really trying, I'm really trying. So Instagram, my handles Amy, Elisa Wong and LinkedIn. I happen to be there quite a bit.

Same handle. Amy Elisa Wong. [01:16:00] And look out for TikTok. My social media person is like, we really need to get you on TikTok, Amy. And I'm like, all right, maybe it was my arm. So that maybe like, I believe that's coming. That's awesome. Well, I owe you an apology. I am dyslexic and we were talking before how everything's so distracted with this construction.

But Amy, Elisa Wong you, it's pronounced both ways. Amy Eliza or Amy Elisa. You can say it. Yeah, you can say it either way. It's because it's the Mexican Amy Elisa Wong. But a lot of people say Eliza, I, I, I respond and love both so well. If it's your name, it's how you say it. So Amy Elisa Wong. Ladies and gentlemen, this was Amy Elisa Wong.

So Amy, thank you so much for being able to say you're a Remarkable woman. Ladies and gentlemen, you've heard Amy think, pray about what she said, start applying it to your life. Check out her book Living On Purpose and go to her website and [01:17:00] continue the conversation because like our slogan says for the show, don't just listen to crank content, but do it.

Repeat the actions you need to each day so you can have a great life in this world, but most importantly, for attorney to come. So, I'm David Pasqualone. This is our Remarkable friend, Amy. Amy, thank you again for being here. Thank you, David. Such a pleasure. Thank you. Oh, it's an honor. All right. Thank you for being here, everyone.

We'll catch you in the next episode. Chow